Paying It Forward: Helping Nonprofits Help Others With Christian LeFer
Are you planning to start a nonprofit but don’t know where to begin? Do you want to start helping people and avoid the tedious work that hinders you from doing so? Today’s guest might be the help you need. Christian LeFer is the Founder of InstantNonprofit, where he helps nonprofit businesses launch their vision to help change the world for the better minus the Byzantine bureaucratic processes. He chats with Chad Burmeister to discuss what motivated him to start his organization and the role his faith played in its success. He also shares an interesting perspective on applying quantum physics theory and treating nonprofits as a quantum entity to transcend barriers between people. Listen in to hear how Christian changed his life for the better through faith and how he’s paying it forward by helping others help others and become their best self.
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Paying It Forward: Helping Nonprofits Help Others With Christian LeFer
I'm with someone who shares the name of my best friend from college, Christian LeFer. He is a cool Founder and CEO of 3,000 happy clients with a company called Instant Nonprofit. Having gone through the nonprofit hoop-jumping of my own with the show, I can tell you, I wish and maybe still can work with Christian because we have some hoops to continue to jump through. We didn't find him early enough. Christian, welcome to the show.
Thanks so much, Chad. I'm super excited to be here.
It's pretty cool. You have 3,000 clients and 1.6 million 501(c)(3) in the US. That's a lot of 501(c)(3)s and 70,000 new ones every single year. The net asset is $4.3 trillion. That's a big industry. We are going to jump a little bit into your business. Before we do that, I would like our audience to get to know you by asking you the question. When you were younger, before you were in your teenage years, what was your thing? What did you find you were passionate about? What were some of your first memories?
I was passionate about anything with wheels. That probably came from my dad who was a savant Porsche mechanic. He was a German foreign car mechanic but he had a particular affinity for Porsches. I grew up on skateboards, bicycles and jumping things. My mom, thankfully, didn't have to take me to the hospital too often but I'm sure she was convinced that I would be in the ER quite a bit. I love to get in the air and have wheels spinning. If two wheels of the four could be off the ground, doing some crazy turn jump, I was into that.
When I was about eight and I was riding my bike when this happened, my mom called me inside, sat me down and explained that she had gotten back from the doctor with my little sister. No one understood why she didn't speak at almost four years of age. She appeared to be like all the other kids but she was developmentally disabled. It's what we call mentally retarded back then in the '70s. I ended up going to Special Olympics and experiencing things that I didn't know at that time but were the social fabric of nonprofits in our country.
Fast forward many years later, I went to start a nonprofit for a completely different reason. I became morally outraged when the IRS was like, "Kid, good luck. Don't worry. It's going to take a while. Your approval would probably take a year." I was morally outraged that anyone who wants to do good would have to go through this Byzantine crazy process and then wait a year and probably run into a bunch of delays or spend thousands of dollars on an attorney or a service only to experience a lot of those same delays. I set about fixing that so that people could actualize the greatest thing in themselves, which is bringing change, hope and a better future to all of us.
My cousin, who is two years younger than me, is mentally retarded. I still think of the same term because that's what we heard when we were kids. Developmentally disabled is the new terminology. I still see her every once in a while if we go back to Wisconsin. She always got the same smile on her face. She calls me Sad, "Hi, Sad." She carries around a pumpkin or at least that's what she did when she was in her teens and twenties, and she probably still does, with some playing cards. I remember how happy she is and I thought, "She is probably closer to God than most people that I know because she hasn't been filtered. She doesn't have to have certain filters of the world. It's an interesting perspective that she can be smiling all day and not have to worry about a lot of stuff."
It sounds like your cousin and my sister would get along famously. She taught me to be a better human. Part of me that people like and that I like, whether people like it or not, I would like this. I have a childlike enthusiasm about things and a little smirk. I like to go about things in the way of a child, find joy and adventure, and even hard things. My sister taught me to be able to live in the present. I had read Eckhart Tolle. I meditate and think about it in order to stop worrying about the past or the future and stay right here but there is only the now to my sister. That's so cool. She is the happiest person I know.
Sometimes I think my sister is developmentally disabled but she went to CU Boulder and I went to CSU. We won't hold that against her.
It's so funny. Sometimes I will explain my sister is mentally disabled and they are like, "That's not very nice." "No, really."
It's interesting because I talked to someone who went to prison. He was on methamphetamine and he called it being broken. He got to the point where he was like, "I'm broken. The only way out of this is either one, take this razor blade, go in the shower and never come out or two, admit I'm broken and ask for help. I did that and I asked God for help. You wouldn't believe what happened after that. It was like body trembles and shakes." He went in his mind and God was telling him, "You’ve got to do this and make amends here." Now, he is amazing.
If you think of my cousin or your sister on a scale of being closest to God and being an amazing, happy person, and you think of this guy, he is an amazing guy. He preaches in his home on weekends to 3 to 8 people. He is a self-made pastor. I was like, "That's pretty neat." It's harder for people in suits that have massive levels of success to come to those kinds of realizations. It's a fabulous story. I love this.
You’ve got that conversation at age four and that was a life-changer. There are always things that happen along the way that gives us a gut punch where we are like, "How is that?" It's devastating event. Is there something you are comfortable sharing that you faced? How did you make it through? What were your tactics to get through that event?
It's pretty counterintuitive. It used to be hard to share and it's not at this point because I've got a little perspective on it. Years ago, nothing was working. I was trying to be a good dad, company Founder and all of these things and relying on my natural talents but I was broken. At some point, I withdrew from every cosmic bank account.
I always tried to bet on the common, "Things are going to be better tomorrow. I will do this and that." The harder I worked, the more I augured myself into the ground and ended up with everything that I held so tightly. I honestly tried inside the paradigm, inside who I was, to keep it all together and everything fell apart.
Everything ended up on fire with my marriage, relationship with my kids, business and body. Nothing worked and it all went up in flames. It was at that moment that I had what some people would call a satori transformation. It's Zen terminology. I don't believe any longer that being Born Again is an act of statement. It is an act of true rebirth from the inside. I walked away from my faith and everything that I thought I knew so that I could rediscover it. I didn't know what I was doing at that time. I gave up and let go of everything because I knew that my plotting and scheming was what got me where I ended up.
Nonprofit: The stealth mission of this company is to use that relationship to help people realize their greatest.
Every time I had an idea, "I'm going to fix this. I'm going to do that," I had the sense that I had already tried everything that I could and it wasn't successful. I needed to operate under a completely new paradigm. I opened up my heart and laid it all down. All of it was given back to me on terms that I'm so thrilled to live on ever since. I showed up more genuinely. I realized I didn't need to know all these doctrines and be sure of all of these things because I had gone from what Alan Watts would call going from being the priest to the mystic. When you experience God, it's an entirely different affair than studying and reading in things but not truly getting it inside.
I'm so thankful that I had that time because I'm rediscovering faith. I'm rediscovering every day what things mean to me with a level of joy, openness and acceptance that I never had in my life where I gave up all the negative self-talk and self-abuse. I grew up where, if you fail, then something is wrong with you and you better drive yourself harder. That's not the way. That's not what God created us for. He didn't create us to be slaves to those things. I'm super thankful to be liberated of all that and now step into every day in whatever kind of storm is coming at you, being able to experience love and joy inside all of those things, not just in the good times but in the challenges as well. It's awesome.
I talked to a guy named Vince Poscente. He competed in the Olympics. I talked to him on the show and he was in skiing. He was a recreational skier and then, four years later, he was in the Olympics. He hit the buzz sauce in 2008. It was his year and financial turmoil is when all the 2008 stuff hit. He decided to give up control and say, "Your plan is the plan." He talked about how one part of your brain can only think 2,000 frames per second bit. In the other piece, I always thought it was four million bits per second or whatever the thinking is. It's four billion. He goes, "No, it's with a B."
If you think of that, what you were trying to do with the 2,000 bits per minute is like trying to control this thing. He wrote a book called The Ant and the Elephant. He goes, "It's like trying to have this little ant on the back of an elephant drive the elephant. You’ve got to let the elephant drive and the unconscious mind when you can tap into it." That's what Eastern medicine and a lot of these other cultures that America has moved us away from all of those kinds of connections to the creator over time, as I have started to see over the last couple of years. When you tap into that, it's fun.
The same thing happened to me. Believe me. In March 2019, $200,000 in sales down to $20,000. I was like, "How am I going to pay people on my payroll? What's going on?" Now, it's hand over the reins. We are in talks with some companies that are some pretty big and interesting partnerships. It's because I'm like, "I don't care. I'm trying to help and I want to do good for the world."
Ever since I opened the nonprofit, everything is becoming so smooth and painless. That's what's cool about the 3,000 people you have helped and I'm sure you see this. I have only had 70 or so of these conversations. I can only imagine 3,000 of these over the last several years. It's like a home run. You are in the lane.
Ultimately, a nonprofit is a business entity. The product is different. It's not a tangible product but there still has to be a revenue model, people to do things and some systems. First of all, I still love to do sales calls or strategy sessions, whatever you want to call those free sessions. You help somebody develop their idea a little bit and say, "This sounds viable. You need a little bit more work. Go here. Let me send you a resource."
What's cool is, in this business, our customers are the best people in the world. A lot of them have a heart and don't have the business skills but we can teach that and help them with that. You can't teach someone to have a heart. I have done probably 4,000 sales calls, business calls, development calls, whatever you want to call them, with people who are led by their heart, the chains and the vision that they see. That was the first level of, "This is amazing. I'm blessed to be able to do this."
I realized the real stealth mission of this company. The stealth mission of this company is to use that relationship to help people realize their greatest. If someone realizes the power that is created inside of all of us and can actualize that, they can help 5,000 kids in Haiti and not 50. They can lead a movement where their idea might get propagated all over the world because it has got a great organic model. They can see themselves doing that rather than seeing themselves as small and limited. Our stealth mission has helped transform that company from the inside out because I had this company prior to my personal transformation.
Everything that we do in life is a mirror to our inner life. It was a mess. I created a company I didn't even like to go to work. I was like, "What have I wrought here? This was supposed to be this great thing and now it seems like a burden." When you shift like that on the inside, I took three of the last years while still serving customers and re-ordered the most secret, quiet mundane parts of the business from the books to the fulfillment processes, the technology and everything.
We rebranded in mid-2019 from Yippiekiyay to Instant Nonprofit. We outwardly did the brand change and started the new identity. All of those things that we did in secret now can be known in front of the world and it has helped us create a scalable company. Isn't that funny that I was unscalable and unsustainable, operating the way I used to?
The business transformed right along with me and now I have a dream team. I love coming to work and everything we are doing. We are ready to grow ever more to be a company that serves this niche at a level that nobody else does or can because we have been reborn from the inside out and brought a beautiful amount of integrity and flow. You were talking about that flow state and flow is being studied now.
I was on a webcast that Steven Kotler did. His whole life is writing books about flow states of extreme athletes, entrepreneurs and Navy SEALs. I believe that being in that flow state, where time evaporates, you don't even know where you are and you are in this blissful state, that's where you know that you are being that person that God created you to be because it's so beautiful. You could operate there forever.
I love these conversations. I do about 4 or 5 a day these days. Juan Lee is on the East Coast. He wrote a book on love. His mom died at age 37 and he was six. The time was tough but she now has a statue of herself in Maryland. He is a cool cat. At age 37, he realized he had a learning disability but he was like, "I didn't know it my whole life until I was 37." He now realizes that he is strong in these other areas. He was like, "If I have Chad and Christian in my court, if we combine all of us into the whole, then I don't have any weaknesses. What are you talking about? I can call anyone I want and fill those areas in. God created me perfect."
I made the statement. I was like, "If you are a 10 here and you are a 1 there." He goes, "No, let me stop you. I'm not a one in anything. I'm perfectly created." I was like, "That's exactly right." We all can tap into each other and it's our responsibility to share that strength. When you realize where people have the weakness, it's like, "Let's join forces. We can help." I'm very passionate about that.
That's the flow state and being able to know who to call, when to take action and when not to take action. You mentioned the church and our roles in how we apply our faith and the mystery in the Eastern Religion. I was a History and PoliSci major so I geek out on this stuff a little bit. We lost some things in the schism between the East Orthodox and the Western Church. They kept some of that mystery. They didn't make everything so literal and materialist. We are an enlightenment-influenced society. Everything is very literal.
Nonprofit: If someone realizes the power that has been created inside all of us and really be able to actualize that, they can help 5,000 kids in Haiti and not 50, or they can lead a movement where their idea might get propagated all over the world.
It's what Dr. Joe Dispenza would call the weight of the particle when the photon is particle and wave. We have to appreciate the wave and that's that mysterious quality that God has imbued in each of us that we can't forget. It's not about figuring things out every time. It's about going inside and intuiting by connecting to him and the oneness that has been created in all of us. I'm into that stuff. It's something that I would love to bring to the world on a greater scale but I can't do that if I don't live it.
Tell me the word quantum. I have heard it several times and I don't know if I have a definition around the quantum. I believe it's that four billion things that you get into this different lane and frequency. 501(c)(3) you call it the quantum entity. What does that mean? Does that relate to quantum what we are talking about with Quantum Physics?
It does. I love Quantum Physics and Quantum Mechanics. It's the final frontier. They have called the things like the God Particle, "What is that mysterious energy? What is all of this stuff made of?" That wall isn't made of anything. When they examine it, the particles can't even be weighed. They don't know why there are atoms. The atoms don't just spin around the nucleus. The electrons pop in and out of existence in different places around the atom.
Einstein knew this and he died with that question on his mind, "What is beyond relativity and Einsteinian Law?" That's the quantum world. The smallest nanoparticle and the tiniest thing that makes this universe what it is is such a mystery. I don't know that we will ever crack that. What they are finding is when they apply these theories in Quantum Mechanics and Quantum Physics, there are things like superposition where something can occupy two different states or spaces at the same time.
I called the nonprofit the quantum entity because we are all in business. We are all trying to connect on these different frequencies and topics of interest. We are right here because someone on your team reached out to me about doing an event and ultimately I looked you up. I saw ScaleX and I was like, "This guy is interesting," but what drew me to you is what makes a nonprofit the quantum entity. That's that you and I vibe on some things. We have never even met but we vibe on some things that I knew we would get along that is not related to a transactional or business thing.
That's why I called the nonprofit the quantum entity is because if you connect with somebody at a heart level and an intentional purpose-driven level, you can transcend all of those linear constraints that we experience in the business. I'm writing a book called Nonprofit The Quantum Entity: How to Superposition your Life, your Legacy and your Future Through a Nonprofit. You can live into completely different worlds through intention, cause and nonprofits.
I always give the example, "If I wanted to meet Tim Ferriss or Warren Buffett, I wouldn't go try to pitch them at a business event. They have multiple layers of gatekeepers for that." My idea is they get thousands of the best ideas in the world. What I would do is I would go to a nonprofit event where our hearts are going to be on the same wavelength about something we care about and I would instantly get that coffee. I could also orient my family. They don't just want to mow the lawn and do the chores so they can get the allowance or borrow the car. They want to be excited about something.
If I introduce them to a cause, "I want to rescue this dog, give it a foster home and then maybe find a home for it," they are so into that. That's where this theory comes in that the nonprofit is the quantum entity because it can help you occupy a completely different realm than you otherwise could through a normal, transactional life. We all are looking for that nowadays to get out of that transactional life and look for more meaning in everything we do.
I used to skateboard, in fact, at my parents' house in a nice neighborhood. I had a very tall mohawk in a nice neighborhood in Colorado with a nose ring and three earrings and they let me do it. They were like, "This is Chad." Most parents would be like, "You can't do that." They let me go far out of bounds. It allowed me to become the person and realize who I am. It's like a corporate rebel thing. I remember even skateboarding up the wall on there and I'm completely sideways. I jumped three trash cans and neat stuff. It's getting connected on that level.
The other thing I would share, Kraig Kleeman is a self-proclaimed World's Greatest Cold Caller and I believe that he is. He is a friend of mine. He knows Bono of U2 personally because he used exactly what you described. He was in Amsterdam. He was sitting down at the table with his brother. His brother is a partier, too. They both are. The brother goes, "You claim you are the best cold caller in the world. There's Bono. Get a meeting with him." All these people came up and they were like, "Bono, I love your music."
This Pacific Islander was standing there with his arms crossed, a gatekeeper beyond all gatekeepers. Kraig was like, "I'm not going to play your stupid game." Finally, he goes, "Come on, Kraig. You’ve got to do it." He goes, "Okay." He stands up, takes his wine glass, catches Bono's eye and goes, "Bono, I would like to raise my glass to you for the work you do with the people of Africa." He used this term. I don't remember precisely how but the word salt of the Earth was somehow in there. Only if you know Bono to a deep level would you know that he does it like that.
Bono raised the glass 20 feet away and then they both sit down. The bet was, "I will pay for your whole weekend of food, drink and hotel." The brother goes, "You didn't get the meeting. I'm not paying for your weekend." Bono's Pacific Island friend comes over and goes, "Bono would like to have dinner with you, too." They spent the whole night there for hours. Now, Bono flies him around the country, the world and for one concert per year, gives him a backstage pass and Kraig gets to meet him every time.
That's exactly what I'm talking about. I love that you came up with the application right off the bat.
I knew we would hit it off on this call. We are very new in nonprofit. I definitely think we need to continue the dialogue after the show. We could be number 3,001, 4,001 or whatever it is. It's an amazing conversation. One last question for you before we go and we have already touched on it but I always like to get the variation around faith.
To me, I took an online app and it's called OnPurpose.me. I have always wondered what my purpose was. This app puts these two phrases together. It's like 64, and then you get through the elite 16 and then the 8 but you don't know it. I'm doing one at a time. I’ve got to the last two words and it was embracing grace. Not embrace grace but embracing.
It's an active word. When you can know that, "God put me here. I'm a person that can eat, drink, talk and smell. I've got a lot of neat skillsets. I meet a lot of neat people," and you can come from that level of power, that's my thing of, "I need other people to understand that they should embrace grace. You are here too, just like me. It's awesome." What role does faith play in your journey?
Nonprofit: All eventualities are present in the quantum future, you place yourself there, and then your body, your spirit, your psyche, and God all align to bring you that feeling in the future.
It is everything. What's funny is I have even let go. I know letting go will come back to me, running over, multiplied. It's even the term faith, "What does that mean? Does that mean my belief or actions?" If I were to pick two words like that, it would be actualizing joy. For me, I get to actualize joy in every moment for myself. Also, actualize can be, "How do you bring this about for others to create and hold that space for others and help them see in the same way?"
It is me walking around every single day, every single minute, every podcast or walking outside in the sun. I take my shirt off. I get some vitamin D down here in Denver Tech Center several times a day in between work sessions. I'm overcome by joy, beauty and living in that space where you are not going at the end of the day, "What was today all about? I can't even remember. I was doing the spreadsheets and I was doing all the stuff." Being able to come back into that moment and go, "How amazing it really all is now," and to be able to come back to that place often, to me, that is faith.
There's a new nonprofit called Joy Lee. They are moving to the Denver Tech Center and you should meet them. You sit in the chair of joy. It's about 8 feet tall. It's gold embossment on the edge. It's white cloth or maybe leather. In her exercise that she takes you through, there's a psychologist that's part of it. It's not a made-up thing but it's real.
They call it stacking joy like, "Think of something joyful for you." "Having my daughter and my son. The day I’ve got married." "Got it." If you take one minute three times a day, sitting in your chair, took in a breath and thought, "That day when my daughter was born and she goes to college tomorrow. That one is top of mind," you bring joy right in. All the other junk is like, "Leave that outside my door."
What happens, I believe, is your body is a guide. You take in these experiences and you can hold onto them. You can make yourself sick with negative experiences in reliving those. The research is showing through neuroscience and all kinds of amazing things that are studying now that by remembering that moment and feeling that feeling, that can be transmuted into other areas of life. We are encouraged to do this in the Bible. For things that have not transpired yet, you can experience that feeling related to that future event, which is simply an eventuality in that quantum future.
All eventualities are present in the quantum future. You place yourself there, and then your body, spirit, psyche, and God all align to bring you that feeling in the future. If what you want is good, pure, lovely and all of those things, and you can embody that feeling and associate it with that desire of yours, if it's a good desire, I believe that that is how we can manifest things that aren't to be yet. I dream of speaking from some stages, from some influencers and talking about this message. A few times a day, I sit down, close my eyes and imagine hearing back from that crowd that energy, love and joy. That's going to help me to get there way faster than going, "I better finish that spreadsheet."
When you talked about your faith definition and even giving that one up, there's a quote I found. I'm not good at memorizing verses so I need to work on that. It's 2 Peter, "Dear brothers, work hard to prove that you really are among those God has called and chosen, and then you will never stumble or fall away. God will open wide the gates of heaven."
There's another one. It's not that one. It's similar to that. It talked about tithing and I always thought of tithing as 10%. That's because that's what I was educated on. To me, the 10% is not necessarily cash. It could be 10% of your time, talent or possession. It's forming a nonprofit. It's putting in. He was like, "I don't need 50%. Now, I'm in 70% because I have to be because I didn't do the 10% my whole life. I'm making it up on the backend with interest." If you just do 10%, it says, "I will open the floodgates of heaven."
Depending on the translation, one says, "Tempt me on this," but God would never say, “Tempt me.” The real word is, "Prove me on this." It's like, "Go ahead, tempt me or go ahead, prove it." Give 10% of your time. When you know you are in the extra innings above ten, you are like, "God, I'm following and I can tell you beyond a reasonable doubt." I have been in that state for maybe 18 to 20 months. Look out, world. The floodgates of heaven are coming. There's no doubt about it. Tempt him.
That's where I'm at now and things are opening up. We have some awesome things coming up and partners coming out of the woodwork. I haven't had time to do the outreach that I would like to. My phone rings and the CEO of the other company is going, "We get people who need your services and we keep hearing good things. We want to send all our business to you or recently we have been sending business to your competitor. We feel like you are the company that we want to send our customers to." I sit back and get to receive that. It's wonderful. It's the same exact concept.
If you read this blog now, you have learned a lot. I hope some of it touched your heart because we are not making this stuff up. I have a shirt, "You can't make this stuff up," with a different word at stuff. You can if you just try it. We launched 77Pray, the app. There are 65 subscribers. It went from fifteen. Now, it's 65 in two weeks. We think it's going to go viral. When you talk to God in the morning, and then you talk to God at night, even if it's a one-minute thing, "God, help me tap into my four billion frames per second. Lead me." When you ask that simple question and allow it to tap into that other part of your brain, try that for 20 or 50 days in a row or 77 is better.
The conscious mind is indeed just the tip of the iceberg. The massive power of our abilities lies in the subconscious. This is the problem in Western life and even in the Western Church and that literal paradigm, I was talking about. That materialist paradigm is that, "You have to be still to know what he can do and what all of this is all about." There's so much noise.
You have probably seen the movie, The Social Network. Fifty-five engineers in Silicon Valley are engineering the distraction of two billion people. Why? It's the biggest currency in the world. If we can take down that noise, get out of beta, get into theta and get your brainwaves down is what I'm talking about. Stop trying to figure everything out all the time and allow that quiet space. That is where the power comes in and blows your mind.
We have been talking with Christian LeFer with InstantNonprofit.com. I'm definitely customer 3,001. Everybody should do business with you if they are trying to start a nonprofit. What an awesome conversation. Christian, thank you for joining.
Thank you. I can't wait to see you again.
Everybody, thanks for joining the show. We will catch you next time.
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About Christian LeFer
Christian has raised millions and run many successful campaigns during his decade-plus of fundraising and creating & marketing solutions to benefit the nonprofit sector. His mission is to empower heroes across the world to make an impact for good. His lifelong battles against Simon Bar Sinister led to expanding civil liberties and as a certified therapeutic foster and adoptive parent . When he's not swimming with his family, Christian might be found in Moab ahead of a cloud of dust trailing from his dirt bike.
